Speaking at Fedez and Mr Marra’s event, Beppe Grillo denies wanting to return to politics. “The M5S? It’s a normal party now.”

Beppe Grillo has re-emerged on the public scene: first, the relaunch of his famous blog; then, a reconciliation with some of his long-standing allies; and finally, the ‘new logo’ of the Five Star Movement appearing on his WhatsApp profile. Today, the comedian appeared on the Pulp podcast with Fedez and Mr Marra, in one of the most eagerly awaited episodes of the year.

As for the possibility of a return to politics, perhaps at the helm of a new party – a scenario that has been the subject of speculation – Grillo was categorical: “How am I supposed to found a party, to organise it? I don’t have the power or the ability to do so; I’m afraid not. I can offer input, some extraordinary ideas.” The former ombudsman then expressed his thoughts on the current state of the Movement: “I’ve got nothing against the Movement; they’re a clever lot.” For this reason, he responded to Fedez’s subsequent question by saying he was in complete agreement with a possible name change for the party, also “to make way for Reverend Jones”. Read: Giuseppe Conte.

For Grillo, what drives the M5S today is simply a “completely different spirit” from that of the past, which involved limits on remuneration and the number of terms for elected representatives: “I still believe that; it was what set us apart from other parties. Now it’s a normal party.” On these points, his stance has never changed: “I’d rather have an amateur doing something new than a professional politician doing something old.” When asked if he felt betrayed by this change, the former face of the Movement’s first response was: “I was ousted; that’s a fact.”

The podcast episode had been previewed last week by a trailer, which had reignited the clash between Grillo and the current M5S leader, Giuseppe Conte. In the short clip, the former Five Star Movement ombudsman described Conte as ‘Reverend Jones’ and ‘the man who whispered to quibbles’, continuing his indictment of the party for having strayed from its original inspiration. The former prime minister responded to Grillo that very evening, during the programme Dritto e Rovescio, with a curt: ‘Say what you like. It is no longer a matter concerning the M5S”.

The rise of Futuro Nazionale and its leader Roberto Vannacci was also discussed in the interview. On this subject, Grillo commented: “Vannacci’s future lies in stupid questions, with a subtle undercurrent of resentment, to which he replies in correct Italian.” The comedian added: “He’s like a sticker – the more you spit on it, the more it sticks.”

During the lengthy episode, Grillo also discusses his relationship with Mario Draghi: “With this devil’s banker who thought I was the one who’d jump up and tell him to go to hell, we found common ground, each with our own doubts. We sized each other up, then, with a touch of irony, we found common ground,” he said. Then an anecdote: “We sent each other messages; I’d write to him: ‘The strawberries are ripe.’ And he’d reply: ‘The blueberries aren’t.’ I did the same with Mastella, the Home Secretary; in a post I wrote: ‘Mastella is in the woods, watch out.’ He sent the police round to the back of his house.”